What Retreat Leaders Can Learn From a Brother and Sister Team

[00:00:00]  Dan Berger: Welcome to the Assemble podcast. I’m Don Berger, founder of Assemble Hospitality Group. We build purpose design spaces for small team offsites and retreats because the biggest things happen in the smallest rooms. This show is about retreats in all forms, corporate lifestyle, wellness, and even family reunions, and the culture shifts that happen when people step away from the everyday.

[00:00:24] You’ll hear lessons from operators, facilitators, and leaders who know how to design experiences that move the needle. My goal give you the playbook for building clarity, trust, and belonging on your team or in your community.

[00:00:40] Kaley and Paul, welcome to the pod.

[00:00:42] Kaley Klemp: Thanks for having us, Dan.

[00:00:43] Paul Warner: Yeah, great to be here, Dan.

[00:00:45]  Dan Berger: So before I start, I want to go ahead and read your bios. Kaley, I’ll start with you. Kaley is an expert in small group dynamics and leadership development who has facilitated retreats and trainings worldwide since 2004.

[00:00:57] That’s almost over 20 years. Yeah. She helps executives and their teams strengthen communication, resolve conflict, and foster trust so they can achieve shared objectives. Her approach blends strategic insight and deep work on relationships enabling lasting impact at both the organizational and personal level.

[00:01:14] Again, welcome Kaley.

[00:01:15] Kaley Klemp: Thanks.

[00:01:17]  Dan Berger: Paul Warner is a seasoned facilitator and coach who works with executive teams YPO forms and families to foster transparency, trust, and authentic connection, blending experiential retreats, group workshops, and one-on-one coaching. He helps participants navigate difficult conversations, deepen relationships, and unlock shared purpose.

[00:01:36] With lifelong exposure to the world of leadership and self-reflection, Paul brings warmth, clarity, and a steady hand to help groups and individuals transition toward greater awareness and alignment. Welcome again, Paul.

[00:01:48] Paul Warner: Thank you.

[00:01:49]  Dan Berger: So let’s let the cat out of the bag. You are a brother and sister,

[00:01:53] Kaley Klemp: siblings,

[00:01:54]  Dan Berger: siblings.

[00:01:55] And I wanna first talk about what it’s like being in the same industry. We’ll talk about your dad in a second, since you’re almost generation, second generation. But I wanna start by understanding what’s the sibling dynamic like? And Paul, why don’t you start?

[00:02:08] Paul Warner: I’m really lucky to have Kaley as an older sister, one to be a mentor in this space.

[00:02:14] Also a colleague. Often, I’ll phrase it that we work alone on a lot of events that we do, so call ourselves a loosely knit network even though we have our own individual practices. So to be able to have a sibling that I can connect with, talk about different events, get her feedback, as she mentioned earlier, as we are gonna chatting earlier, we went for a walk on Sunday to catch up is humans, but then also can weave in work dynamics.

[00:02:40] I also have a 13 month old at home, and Kaley has been above and beyond as I see you here, Kaley, you’ve just been so awesome and how you showed up for me, Hayley and Aubrey. So to be able to blend my personal life and work life together is really a dream. Something I wasn’t, you know, sure that I wanted until I got here and realized how sweet it is that we can really share these two paths together.

[00:03:04]  Dan Berger: Awesome. So Kaley, same question, but I’m gonna add to that a second question. Have you ever worked together? Have you facilitated something together?

[00:03:11] Kaley Klemp: I would echo all of Paul’s sentiments that it’s such a treat when I get to refer work to Paul, I always say to the groups some version of, I recognize that I’m extremely biased.

[00:03:23] I really think that he’s superb, so check my own nepotism, if you will, but I think that I hold Paul to a higher standard than other facilitators, and that’s quite fun. As I think about working together, Paul, it’s been a minute that you and I used to facilitate a little bit more together, but it hasn’t been in recent days.

[00:03:45]  Dan Berger: So Paul, obviously your dad has been guiding light in the world of facilitation. One can argue he may have been, he’s the godfather of facilitation. Walk us through how to be in a second generation family that does facilitation.

[00:04:00] Paul Warner: Well, actually it starts back when I was a teenager, candidly, kind of zero to 14, when he was running a computer software company.

[00:04:08] We had more of a strained relationship. Um, he was traveling a lot was on the road. I was a little bit of a mama’s boy and was kind of shy having to ask my younger sister to ask a waiter, a waitress for more water or catch up at a restaurant. But then during his transition, when he switched to becoming a facilitator and coach full-time, he and another man named Tom Pitner wrote a program called Becoming a Man, really addressing the rite of passage from adolescents into early adulthood.

[00:04:35] And that’s where we really started to connect. So that was the on-ramp into this work. You know, as you mentioned, I’ve always kind of seen him as the godfather of this space, and not only in this space, but also as a dad adding another layer of a shadow so that I, you know, the challenge of stepping up to following his footsteps was difficult, but he did in a really nice job of laying out breadcrumb trails saying, Hey, why don’t you carry my bag for this event?

[00:05:01] I need a guy to come and play a role for this corporate event. Please join me for this YPO forum retreat is I really think that your youthful energy could be something that would really help the energy and vibe of this, this forum. So he gave me opportunities to get a taste, to start, to feel it out, to be in the room with him.

[00:05:20] And then the second thing I think he did really well was he pointed me towards other phenomenal resources on my side. Say that part of my experience is I got to shadow the best of the best one other person being on this call here. So I got to ride with Kaley, I got to ride with Mark Rebus, I got to ride with Vince Casaro, and that helped me, I identify or realize that, that I could have my own unique voice and did not speak to be Jim Warner in this space.

[00:05:45] Mm-hmm. So that was really how my path kind of got interwoven with Jim and others, where I was able to find my, my space, my voice, my place in this type of work, and have the courage and confidence to go all in.

[00:06:00]  Dan Berger: So just to double click on that, when you say your voice, how do you show up at facilitated events?

[00:06:05] Paul Warner: It’s a good question, and I think that it’s just being fully, authentically myself. And so one of the things I think I can do well with groups is that quickly create a space. Where I blend in with the group, almost, there’s eight people. It’s almost like I’m quickly the ninth member. So when finding my voice is just being authentically me, showing up, being real, sharing part of my story.

[00:06:30]  Dan Berger: Awesome. And Kaley, going back to your dad, what are some things that he has designed that you’ve built on and walk us through specifically what are some tools that he has developed that you currently employ?

[00:06:43] Kaley Klemp: As I go back to the very beginning, I was thinking about Paul’s story and my on-ramp to being a facilitator was my dad and I did nine days in a row facilitating YPO forum retreats in India.

[00:06:56] In day one, he was clearly the lead and I was clearly the co-facilitator. I would say I was almost in a Vana White role where I would provide whatever materials or handouts, and by day nine I remember walking into the room and he looked at me and said. And that was, it was empowering. It was terrifying.

[00:07:17] And yet after doing so many reps so close together, I really felt like I could and did, and I think that he might’ve started the retreat. And at this point in time, I was in my early twenties at that point in time. Why PO was very highly male. So it’s a 20-year-old young woman in a room with 40 something year old male professionals.

[00:07:38] Yeah. And he said, essentially said. You will listen to her for the first 15 minutes and if you don’t like what’s happening, then we’ll switch and the rest of the day was mine. So it was definitely trial by fire, but also very fun. I think that some of the tools that I still build on, I don’t know that it was originally his, I think it was actually Vince Corro who said anything that we claim as our own or copyright in some ways must come with an asterisk of, was this downloaded from the universe or who else named this before I did?

[00:08:11] I think that the way he outlined the issue clearing model is extremely useful, not only in forum environments, but also on executive teams. And also my husband and I wrote a book called The 80 80 Marriage and Tweaked it, where now it’s reveal and Request in a couple. But that format of having a guide for being able to have difficult, challenging.

[00:08:38] Potentially contentious conversations go really well. That’s a tool that I use over and over again.

[00:08:45]  Dan Berger: So Paul, you obviously gotten into, into the game later, just given your age, what advice do you have for people who wanna also facilitate and start their own career in this field?

[00:08:59] Paul Warner: Accounts would be to create your own.

[00:09:02] Small groups, see your own coaches, start doing your own work. I think I got really lucky when I was in the univer. I was in college my sophomore year. My dad was down for a forum retreat and me and a buddy of mine were at the Fountain Blue Hotel sitting by the pool and he was saying, how did you, what?

[00:09:18] What are you doing here again, Jim? This is your job. And he explained the concept of forum to us and my buddy Adam Silverstein said, well, can you do that for us? So as 20 year olds, he, we did a three day retreat. Eight of us created a YPO forum like group, small group. And for 15 years we were active and we followed the models to the team.

[00:09:40] We met monthly. And to me, that’s where I got the confidence and experience to feel that I could start doing this week work professionally. So I’d say start doing your own work. Find your own small group. I also got one, a mentor one time said there’s two types of fees in this space. Free and then quite expensive for bigger engagements.

[00:10:01] So I also did a lot of pro bono work to sharpen the blade. You get experience. So I’d say start doing your own work. Find a small group, find a coach on your own, and see if there’s outlets where you can start serving other people to find your niche, get your confidence,

[00:10:17]  Dan Berger: and you do some family work as well.

[00:10:18] Uh, tell us a little bit about that and what that means. Family forum, corporates, they all have issues to clear. They all have their own. Shit they bring into the meeting. Families are the same way. So what does family work facilitation look like?

[00:10:34] Paul Warner: Sure. There’s a one line I heard that was quite funny. It says when you’ve worked with one family, you’ve worked with one family.

[00:10:41] They’re all uniquely different. But this comes back to my story, is that when I first got into the business as well, again talking about my dad. In a two year program called Empowering the Rising Generation, where he was the elder, I was the young adult. We gotta to do role plays, talk about the She Clearing model, how we show up, engage and listen to each other.

[00:11:03] And so that’s really a sweet spot of mine. I really love this idea of adolescence into early adulthood, evolving family dynamics as parents also become empty nesters. And after doing a lot of work with Forum Dynamics, saw that there’s so many. Areas where there can be overlap. And so similarly we’ll do virtual trainings, but the sweet spot is a multi-day offsite where we can get together, unpack some of the lingering issues that may be around from our youth, learn some tools, models, have some guideposts for how we engage, how we communicate, play with real live dynamics, but then also look into the windshield.

[00:11:44] What’s the path forward? What values guide our steps? How can we utilize some of these tools so that we can really define an adult to adult relationship? So shifting from that adolescence to early adulthood and what does it look like for adult to adult? And it’s funny also, people will ask us and say, wow, your father’s a facilitator, your older sister and you, your dinner tables must be just so dynamic and wonderful and and really curious.

[00:12:09] And we’re like normal families. We’re like plumbers who have leaky pipes at home. We fall into drama. We have to practice what we preach, so we have live learnings as we go. That is really fun to be able to capture that and translate how we could share that with other families.

[00:12:24]  Dan Berger: Awesome. Yeah, I have so many more questions on that, but Kaley, I wanna go back to you.

[00:12:28] You’re known as one of the best facilitators, according to your peers. Why do you think that is?

[00:12:33] Kaley Klemp: That’s such a compliment and it feels like such a challenging question to field. Hopefully it’s because I keep doing my own work that I really agree with what Paul said a few minutes ago around, if you wanna get into this field, start doing your own work.

[00:12:50] And I would say what keeps me. Sharp is never ceasing to do my own work. I tell every potential coaching client that engages with me at any point in time. I have a coach and a therapist, and sometimes both at the same time, that I have my own forum that I always want to be engaging and learning. I think that if at any point in time.

[00:13:17] I’m hearing myself say something where it’s like, oh, this is the point where I press play and I say the thing and then I tell the joke, and then the room laughs. That to me says I’ve stopped growing and I work to never get to the point where I stop growing.

[00:13:32]  Dan Berger: A quick pause to thank our sponsor, facilitator directory.com.

[00:13:36] Facilitator directory.com is the number one resource for finding a facilitator. Whether you’re looking for someone to lead your executive offsite, facilitate a forum or guide a wellness retreat,

[00:13:46] Paul Warner: facilitator directory.com is the place to find top rated facilitators, guides, and team coaches. And now back to the show.

[00:13:53]  Dan Berger: So I’m fascinated by, by the tools facilitators use. Can you tell us about some of the tools you’ve developed and why they’re your favorite?

[00:14:02] Kaley Klemp: Hmm. Much of my toolkit is built on other people’s tools.

[00:14:06]  Dan Berger: Sure.

[00:14:07] Kaley Klemp: So I love. Above and below the line, which I don’t even know where that came from. Brene Brown is now talking about it in her work, which is quite fun.

[00:14:17] I love the Drama Triangle. Same thing where who was the original, I think it was Carman. I find some of these tools really, really powerful in continuing to iterate with them and on them. I am a huge fan of the Enneagram, a personality system,

[00:14:33]  Dan Berger: which I think you’re certified in.

[00:14:35] Kaley Klemp: I am certified from the Enneagram Institute.

[00:14:38] What I love about the Enneagram, I think that every personality system has something to contribute to the conversation. And what I love about the Enneagram is it’s the tool that for me, gave me why, what’s the motivation behind this behavior versus some other tools, which were like, Hey, Kaley, you’re super extroverted.

[00:14:56] Good luck with that. I really appreciated that the Enneagram came with coaching tools around how to spend more time at my best, rather than just being limited to. Great. Now you fit into a box. Thanks so much. Some of the tools that I have really worked to develop are the mental models around where coaching and where leadership overlap.

[00:15:22] That for me, there’s a Venn diagram, and this shows up in particular in corporate spaces where there is expertise that people have developed over years of having a career, and there are coaching tools around reflective listening and good questions and leading from a step behind and finding that intersection so that it ceases to be an either or.

[00:15:45] Either you’re a leader or you’re a coach. How can you really embody that space? That’s a whole set of work that my colleague Sue Heel Broner and I have placed our attention on and actually created a whole coaching certification for what we call leader coaches.

[00:16:01]  Dan Berger: Amazing. And for those who are interested in those tools, they can Google them and learn a little more.

[00:16:06] Paul, same question to you, and then I’d like to talk about mentorship.

[00:16:10] Paul Warner: Sure thing. Just laughing quickly also about the Enneagram. Kaley is such an ace, and I can remember when I was a teenager when she was going through her certification, like pounding my fists on the table, being like, I don’t know what you guys are talking about with these different numbers and these different wings, and all the support, but it found that to be so helpful.

[00:16:28] Also, I think one area that I’ve really focused on and evolved a little bit is the simple concepts, but the art of reflective listening. My father coined a phrase called plexiglass, or the metaphor of having a barrier between you and someone else so that anytime someone’s sharing, especially if it’s about you, instead of hitting you in the emotional button, reacting emotionally, you can observe those comments objectively seeking to understand.

[00:16:57] So empathy, as Stephen Covey would say, the fifth level of listening. Seems easy conceptually, but really difficult when you’re in the moment when real stuff is happening. So I’ve played with and evolved the kind of the script of reflective listening, the challenges and the different environments of how to implement that.

[00:17:18] And I’ve worked hard to make that a muscle that’s really strong and the different environments that I’m playing. And, and like Kaley said, almost everything else in my toolkit is. Someone else’s stuff that I’ve evolved and played with. And we challenge ourselves on a yearly basis in our kind of facilitator camps on how we can continue to push the envelope for new ideas, different, uh, different exercises that we can bring in.

[00:17:42] Earlier we were mentioning life walks and how powerful those can be, um, and how we can continue to evolve those with themes walking forwards, walking backwards. Be confusing if you’ve never experienced that. But some of the, just playing with the toolkit that we have, facilitator Camp Kaley, what the hell is that and how does someone get into that?

[00:18:02] Kaley Klemp: Well, first you have to sing a song and do an audition. I’m teasing. Essentially, it’s just a gathering of facilitators where everyone is bringing something that they’re curious about, an idea that they have. Testing out an exercise where sometimes it’s fun to have a paid engagement. Be the Guinea pigs.

[00:18:22] But it’s usually more skillful to have folks who will help you refine an activity, be the first people that you test it on.

[00:18:29]  Dan Berger: Is that like a thing? Is that like, is it an annual event listeners who are trying to get in the space or in the space? Can they just contact you and get in? Is it a real thing?

[00:18:40] Kaley Klemp: Paul, why don’t you take this?

[00:18:42] Paul Warner: It’s definitely a real thing and it’s evolving to the place where, yes, we would be open to having others who are getting involved in the space or are curious to come and play with us. It started, uh, about 30 years ago, my father and some friends. Created a ski facilitator camp, if you will. They called it a boom doggle.

[00:19:00] The definition of a boom doggle is something that gives off the appearance of something meaningful and important, but in all actuality is a giant waste of time. Couldn’t be more opposite, however. So for 30 years, we’d get together around the Super Bowl weekend in February, skiing was kind of the main draw for everyone.

[00:19:17] And yes, we would go out and ski for the day. We’d have the pounders. Who were going hard on the double blacks, the quarter pounders who were working their way up on the blues and blacks, and then the elite super cruisers. We’d all play and ski during the day. But coming in, we’d do prep work. We’d have a big spreadsheet, we’d identify themes and topics that we’d wanna explore and unpack.

[00:19:37] And then after skiing, we’d come back to the complex where we’d have multiple units rented, and then we’d break out into subgroups, cook a meal together. But then for several hours we’d go through different exercises and like Kaley said, an opportunity to play with some of the great tools that we have.

[00:19:54] But then also the challenge to us is to bring new stuff to that audience. Over the years, that entire group became super fluent in the different processes. So we had a lot of leeway to try new things and color outside the lines. And so for 30 years we ran the ski boondoggle, which we closed a few years ago.

[00:20:11] Uh. Um, just ’cause it, it kind of run its course. My mother had said that we wanted to retire as Peyton Manning going out on top versus trying to seek additional, more rings go out. When it was time, we gave it a year or two to breathe and now I’m doing my first new boondoggle this march with a smaller group as a kind of new case study, getting it off the ground again.

[00:20:35] But the idea is that years forward, we’ll open it up to people who are interested.

[00:20:40]  Dan Berger: Well, I’d love to host you and, uh, bring you all here to Boise and experience the retreat facility I’ve been building. I wanna talk about the role of mentorship for facilitation. It sounds like it’s an important role, Kaley, how does someone find a mentor and what’s that process and what role have mentors played for you currently?

[00:20:59] Not in the past, you know, how does somebody find a, a mentor?

[00:21:04] Kaley Klemp: It sounds in some ways flippant, but the best way I think to find a mentor is to ask them whether they are willing to be your mentor. And then I think I have been asked to mentor people and I have current mentors, and what I think is part of the arrangement is doing your homework and being prepared that.

[00:21:26] As I seek out mentors, which by the way, several of mine at this moment in time are younger than I am, and I find that just delightful. It’s to come with them with a question or with an idea, or with a book that I’ve read so that when I engage with them, I’m showing them the respect of having done something prior to be ready and tee up the conversation.

[00:21:47] I find it the same when someone comes to me and says, Hey, are you willing to invest in me? Are you willing to be on my personal board of directors? And if they have something where I have some lived experience or I have some expertise and they come with something compelling, I find it absolutely enlivening and it’s at a certain point, I would say mutual that I’m not sure who’s mentoring who at the end of the day.

[00:22:09]  Dan Berger: So I wanna switch gears to business development, and I’d like for you both to talk about it. Obviously, facilitation is not the easiest career because you know, as I often say, those who can’t do teach. Paul, for you, how do you do business development other than word of mouth, or is that the sole way that you find new clients?

[00:22:30] Paul Warner: Primarily it’s word of mouth for me. And to your point, Dan, if I’m doing my job well, I should be working myself out of a job. But also that same note, what I really enjoy is the journey with, so at certain times with clients, we may be diving in deep for a period of time, six months a year, and then we might take a little bit of a break and lean on me as needed over the course of the next couple years.

[00:22:53] And, and sure enough, we’ve had opportunities where a new challenge or a new situation arises where we reengage. So found that it’s a little bit of an edge where I’m not trying to sell or pitch my services. But once we get into that type of space where we’re sharing, going through some of the dynamics that people are facing in their lives, there often is overlap within their families, their companies, their small groups, and find that there’s really nice opportunities to have ongoing work from the different environments that we’re playing in.

[00:23:22]  Dan Berger: So Kaley, I want you to rewind 20 years and how did you do business development?

[00:23:27] Kaley Klemp: I started my career receiving referrals from other facilitators who were too busy.

[00:23:34]  Dan Berger: Hmm.

[00:23:34] Kaley Klemp: And I think that one of the best ways to build a business is to do excellent work and let the folks who have referred to you know that you’ve done excellent work.

[00:23:47] So if I were 20 years ago, I would to Paul’s point, carry the bag of facilitator so that when they got an inquiry for a date that they weren’t available. I was top of mind for them.

[00:23:59]  Dan Berger: And Paul, I want you to just kind of build off of that and talk to me a little bit about how do you choose who to refer to?

[00:24:09] I mean, I feel like I’ve done many of these episodes now and I feel like it’s a bit of an inner circle. So how can somebody develop trust so that you refer them to them?

[00:24:20] Paul Warner: Good question. And the shadowing tends to be the. Way to get the most confidence. We’re doing an event together where we’re all participants, where we can see someone else in the space.

[00:24:33] So the Inner Circle community tends to be, because we’ve all played together in different environments, I’ve seen Kaleigh in a variety of different spaces also mean she’s the ace. So actually I can put her in any room, but everyone else that I refer to, we’ve. Participated ourselves in an event or we’ve co-facilitated something together.

[00:24:52] They’ve been a shadow of mine. So we’ve been able to see them in that environment because referring is difficult. Um, you wanna make sure that they’re doing a great job and your name could be on the line. And so that’s what I would suggest is share some space together where we can see, see you in the environment.

[00:25:09] Kaley Klemp: I would add to that, I agree with everything you’re saying, Paul, that having an expertise. That makes it easy for me to know who to refer to you is an added benefit that there is a new facilitator who I just met. His name is Steve Messer, who is an ex Olympian and he’s crystal clear on his value proposition around if you aren’t training the basics, sleep, diet, et cetera, you can’t be the elite leader that you want to be.

[00:25:39] And so when I get inquiries from folks who are like. Hey, my life is a mess. I looked at my Fitbit data. I haven’t had deep sleep for greater than 15 minutes in a year. That’s a clear fit. In the same way that somebody who says, Hey, I’m going into more of a chief of staff or COO role, there’s a facilitator who has been a chief of staff and she’s one of my first calls.

[00:26:04] So I think being really clear on how you are differentiated from others gives people a way to refer to you. When I think too about Paul as another, for instance, anytime there’s an intergenerational family dynamic,

[00:26:18] Paul Warner: Hmm.

[00:26:19] Kaley Klemp: Or there’s a younger person who’s ascending into leadership and striving to claim their voice, Paul is my person.

[00:26:26] Anytime there’s conflict, like between co-founders, that’s a great place where I think to myself, Paul is really an expert here. So having that space where you know, you play brilliantly, I think makes it easier for others to refer to you and have you win the work because it is such a good fit.

[00:26:44]  Dan Berger: So oftentimes when we talk about facilitation, we talk about the soft stuff.

[00:26:48] Let’s move to the, the hardware if you will. How do you. Implement strategic objectives with all the enneagrams and above the line and below the line and all, and empathy. How do you move into strategy and actually get things done?

[00:27:04] Kaley Klemp: I would say that you can’t do the quote unquote hard stuff without the interpersonal dynamics and the alignment of the humans being the foundation.

[00:27:15] And so I wanna do the work in the correct sequencing because we can all align around, okay, this is gonna be our, and then choose your model. These are our OKRs, or these are our KPIs, or this is our V two mom, and we all nod at each other in the room, and then we go off to our silos and we complain about each other.

[00:27:32] We won’t actually get there. And so getting the issues cleared, making sure that there is candor in the room, ensuring that there’s a hundred percent responsibility. Do we have clean agreements with those foundations? Then we can put things on that piece of paper where we come back every quarter and check in, did we do what we said we were gonna do?

[00:27:54]  Dan Berger: So do facilitators do that? Are they sitting in the strategy? You know, day two, day three?

[00:27:59] Kaley Klemp: It depends on the engagement. For myself. I typically work a blend. And what that means to me is the initial work is that of context, which is how are we doing our work? Are we curious? Are we claiming responsibility?

[00:28:16] Are we practicing candor? And then the what of the work, which is what are the agreements or what’s the marketing plan or how are we shifting where we operate in? Are we going after enterprise companies versus small business or startups? I will often stay for the strategic conversation with my eye on how are we having those conversations.

[00:28:40] And so that to me is where if we go back to the beginning, that’s that overlap between I actually care, how do you make money and are you going to this quarter? And I care deeply about. How are you having those conversations so that the goals that you select in order to achieve your corporate objectives align.

[00:29:01]  Dan Berger: Got it. Well, we’re almost out of time. I wanna ask you both my last question, which is, and I’ll start with Paul. Is there anything I should have asked that I haven’t

[00:29:10] Paul Warner: probably should have asked Kaley about her upcoming book? Busy Look. Okay. I’ve been getting tons of feedback on walks just from my own relational dynamics.

[00:29:20] Not to plug the book, but I wish I just did. But in a general sense, she, that’s an area where Kaley and her husband, Nate Klemp, have just been awesome. The 80, 80 marriage that she mentioned, and I’ve gotten sneak peeks and snippets of some of the things that they’re playing with upcoming. Other than that, I think that we’ve honored our father, Jim Warner plenty here as the Master Yoda of the Jedi night force that he is created of facilitators out there.

[00:29:44] So you hit that one nail on the head. I think busy love would be the area that I would play in and, uh, to learn a little bit more about. And the last thing that you were sharing there, too, ke I think you, is that what you call the coach in the room? That mm-hmm. Is that the phrase that you put together? I love, it’s how you put that together of helping.

[00:30:00] For that multi-day event. So maybe coaching the room and busy love would be areas I’d, I’d nudge you towards Dan.

[00:30:06]  Dan Berger: So Kaley, since Paul changed the question, I’ll ask you, what should I have asked Paul about that I haven’t asked about?

[00:30:13] Kaley Klemp: One of the areas where I see Paul shine is you do the work and you engage in recreation or fun, or Paul does, what do you call it?

[00:30:24] It’s like the King’s dinner or the Sovereign Dinner,

[00:30:26] Paul Warner: the King’s feast at the end.

[00:30:28] Kaley Klemp: Yes. Ask Paul about the king’s feast. Ask about how you blend, celebration, and play with the work so that it isn’t, we just did a slog, but rather everyone leaves feeling a different level of vibrancy and connection.

[00:30:46]  Dan Berger: Right. So this has been an awesome conversation.

[00:30:48] I thank you both for your time and I look forward to seeing you at a facilitator camp.

[00:30:52] Paul Warner: I hope so soon, Jen.

[00:30:53] Kaley Klemp: Can’t wait.

[00:30:54] Paul Warner: Yeah. Love what you’re doing too.

[00:30:55]  Dan Berger: I just invited myself.

[00:30:57] Paul Warner: Yeah.

[00:30:58] Kaley Klemp: The best way to do it.

[00:30:59]  Dan Berger: That’s right. That’s right.

[00:31:01] Paul Warner: Synergy creation.

[00:31:03]  Dan Berger: Well, thanks again for being here and this was a great conversation.

[00:31:06] Kaley Klemp: So fun.

[00:31:07] Paul Warner: You bet. Thank you.